Quotes about representation for armed forces personnel

The MOD recognises the British Armed Forces Federation and other such organisations as effective mechanisms by which the views of service personnel can become known. Service personnel are free to join them, provided they do not take a particularly active part in any political activity. To be honest, we are not aware of any groundswell of opinion from members of our armed forces that the remit of the armed forces federations should be extended or that they should be established on a statutory basis.

Mark Lancaster MP, Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence, Armed Forces Bill debate, 15 Oct 2015

In the army I would say that the officers know what their men are thinking at all times.

Senior officer evidence to Armed Forces Bill Committee, 1979

It must be for Servicemen themselves, if they so desire, to argue the case for an organisation to represent their collective concerns and to discuss what  the role of such an organisation might be, and how it might function. This is an issue which should be freely debated within the services.

Official Bett Report for MoD (1995)

We have ... examined the practices of other Armed Forces, and have concluded that it is possible for a wide variety of forms of representation to operate usefully, and in harmony with the chain of command.</p Official Bett Report for MoD (1995)

We have not been able to ignore a growing strength of feeling, apparent on our visits and in the responses to our survey, that the time may be approaching when some form of representation outside the chain of command may be required.

Official Bett Report for MoD (1995)

We have to accept that soldiers are free to join whatever union they wish and an entire regiment could all join a single union. Currently, there is not a case pending for the formation of an army union, but the legal advice is that we think that soldiers could form a group under the law — although how closely that would resemble a traditional trade union is open to question.

MoD spokesman quoted in Sunday Times, 10.03.02

We would be happy also to contribute to a wider debate about the representation of the armed forces community and its relationship with the democratic system.

Final sentence of Silence in the Ranks (2005)

When I was commanding in Bosnia, one of the battalions of one of the nations, and I will not tell you which one, laid down its arms because, it said, the pay deal was not right, so they put their arms down. Do you really see British Armed Services doing that? That is the sort of trouble you get into when there is a representative body who are fighting back at home, your soldiers are at the front and they do not appear to be achieving.

CGS evidence to Armed Forces Bill Committee, 16 Feb 2006

There is a growing call for the military to enjoy some of the rights that other citizens take for granted. At every stage the MoD resists allowing the Armed Forces a right to express concern outside the chain of command. This is not acceptable at this stage. The United States and Australia are among the many nations which welcome such independent arrangements.

Since the advent of the new budgetary systems to the way defence works, every commanding officer is put in the position of managing a small business. While trying to manage his budget, he acts, at the same time, as the voice of concern for subordinates, which becomes ever more difficult.

Air Marshal Lord Garden, Deepcut Barracks Debate, House of Lords, 19 Apr 2006.

Perhaps the most distinctive development over the last decade has been the launch of the British Armed Forces Federation (BAFF) as an independent campaigning professional association for serving and retired service personnel...

Out of Step, the case for change in the British armed forces, T Edmunds & A Foster, Demos think tank 2007

While some senior commanders have argued that any independent organisation designed to ''fight for the rights'' of British troops is completely unnecessary and threatens a dangerous breakdown of military discipline, others, such as the late Lord Garden, a former RAF Air Marshal and veteran of the first Gulf War, have been ''surprised talking to retired senior military people who are prepared to think about it, saying there might be a case for it''.

Out of Step, the case for change in the British armed forces, T Edmunds & A Foster, Demos think tank 2007

The central question in the debate on military unions or associations is not what the body representing the interests of members of the armed forces is called but rather how to respect the rights of military personnel to the freedom of association and assembly while at the same time meeting the needs and legitimate concerns of the military, given its unique function.

Handboook on Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms of Armed Forces Personnel, Chapter 9, Military Unions and Associations

The federation will not be a trade union and, above all, it will not conduct or condone any form of industrial action or insubordination within the armed forces. The federation affirms the vital role of the Armed Forces chain of command in representing the interests of its personnel.

BAFF Constitution

I was also concerned that service personnel were beginning to think it was necessary to form an independent organisation - the British Armed Forces Federation - to lobby for improved living accommodation, better medical care and enhanced compensation claim limits.

In my book, looking after individuals should naturally be a principal duty of the chain of command, and I was determined to make the group's existence superfluous. If I, and my senior colleagues, did our jobs properly there would be no need for a federation or union. I was determined that such a movement was not going to gather momentum on my watch.

'Leading from the front', the autobiography (2010) of General Sir Richard Dannatt (now Lord Dannatt) - CGS 2006-9

The Federation shall not condone, encourage or take part in any form of industrial action by its members or insubordination by any members towards their superiors in the chain of command, and shall not commit or procure the commission by any person of any service offence, including mutiny, failure to suppress mutiny, misconduct towards a superior officer, disobedience of lawful commands, or conduct prejudicial to good order and discipline.

BAFF Constitution

We don't need a union. What we need is to raise the profile of BAFF by getting as many people signed up as we can. Every new member and bit of publicity they get is a bit more leverage they have to look after our interests.

ARRSE poster ''Deltadog''

There is no place for an army trade union. There IS a place for an independent staff association which can represent the views of members of the armed forces and engage constructively with government, parliament, the media and the public without any question of industrial militancy, strikes or anything else of that sort. As it happens, one already exists ...

ARRSE poster 'cpunk'